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jazzworldquest View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jazzworldquest Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Aug 2011 at 5:02pm
Originally posted by Atkingani Atkingani wrote:

Originally posted by jazzworldquest jazzworldquest wrote:

Talking about Samba, it's interesting that an Italian song became a famous standard due to Joao Gilberto interpretation!  
Estate(summer) has been composed in '60 by Bruno Martino & Bruno Brighetti.


Not to count the partnership of Chico Buarque with Italian composer Sergio Bardotti and the albums made by Ennio Morricone dedicated to Buarque's songs. Smile

Good point! Italian and Brazilian music have many things in common and the examples can continue!
From wikipedia: Some aspects of Brazilian culture are contributions of Italian, German and other European immigrants; came in large numbers and their influences are felt closer to the South and Southeast of Brazil.



Edited by jazzworldquest - 13 Aug 2011 at 5:09pm
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Matt View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Matt Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Aug 2011 at 5:16pm
Talking about Italian Influences I found that Lucio Battisti's "Anima Latina" is a great example. Will add I love that album which I discovered through Mickey and Raff over at prog archives.
 
Anima Latina
 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atkingani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Aug 2011 at 9:50pm
Yes, seeing from the present perspective we may testify/verify that the bossa nova trend of late 50s and early 60s was much more worldwide than observed at the time. The rhythm with new sounds, new instruments and new arrangements influenced a lot of genres, not only modern jazz and fusion but also soft rock and pop music (check The Doors and Mamas & Papas, for instance).

This influence was not only felt in USA but France, Italy and Japan mainly. The 1966 French movie "A Man and a Woman" (Un homme et une femme) shows this influence clearly. In Italy, we had the famous composer and maestro Morricone trailing the samba & bossa nova fashion too.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dreadpirateroberts Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Aug 2011 at 7:21am
Originally posted by Matt Matt wrote:

Talking about Italian Influences I found that Lucio Battisti's "Anima Latina" is a great example. Will add I love that album which I discovered through Mickey and Raff over at prog archives.
 
Anima Latina
 
Hug


I'm with you there, Matt. I love this album (and pretty much all of his 60s/70s output.) He was amazing
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dionisio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Aug 2011 at 9:51am
Originally posted by Atkingani Atkingani wrote:

Everyone is bald to know that Samba is a genre/style of music 'brother' of Jazz and I think it deserves a tiny space her in the JMA. 

Samba and bossa nova they walk together, yes, but they can be totally two distinct things, I'm portuguese (i dunno if there is a brazilian in the forums that would be perfect to make this clear) i listen to the music from brazil since i remember walking, and in the jazz schools here you learn a lot of bossa (and believe, everytime you go to a jam with a girl.. if it depends on her, youll be playing bossas all night long ahah anyway, not revelant right now), my point is, even that the samba had a big influence on jazz, was the bossa nova that made the real influence, as sonority, structure or even chords and harmonic changes, what i'm saying is that i feel here a bit of a confusion between bossa and samba, at least i would never say that setence exactly like that, even that samba was, and it is, a huge influence in a lot of other music, it is bossa that deserves it space ( im not saying this as a smartass or whatever, just saying because i really think that they are two things totally different and when we think of the influence from brasil it seems more apropriate to say that bossa is the brother of jazz instead of samba). Samba is more like a traditional dance, a.. musical popular manifestation, bossa is something more like jazz, i can't explain it better, bt even if you think about the theoric part of it, the samba its not that close to jazz since its more a rhythm thing, while bossa.. damn.

to finish, i know, bossa nova is sub derived genre of samba, bt it seems more correct this way, and during the 50's the jazz musicians in america were crazy about bossa, not necessarly samba. Bt well, im not here to correct, i dont want to look like snobish, just trying to figure this out (maybe im just used to think it that way, and its because during all my entire life and through some jazz schools we say everytime bossa and not samba, taking samba as something different.. at the end of the day, its just a name ! Give us some brazilian rhythms and i'm happy ! )


Edited by dionisio - 16 Aug 2011 at 9:53am
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote js Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Aug 2011 at 10:27am
Guigo will be along, he is Brazilian and knows his music. Cool
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atkingani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Aug 2011 at 2:48pm
Samba and jazz are considered siblings 'cause they have the same craddle, I mean, slaves and former slaves of African descent, with their parents and grandparents coming mainly from Western Africa (today Angola, Nigeria, Ghana, Togo, Benim). They have brothers, sisters and cousins throughout the Americas (Cuba, Jamaica, Venezuela, etc).

Those 2 genres also evolved, developed and reached maturity at the same time, from mid to late 19th Century up to early 20th Century but later they took different ways due to the different environments they lived. Being that after the 1910s and 1920s, the American entertaining and musical culture hold sway of the world and it was natural that samba started to undergo some influences from jazz and sooner two streams appeared: one more traditional and another more receptive to external sources.

During WWII more than 1 million US soldiers passed through Brazil ih their way to North Africa and Italy and we saw a two-way interchange: new forms of jazz coming and samba, chorinho and other Brazilian rhythms going. By late 40s, Lucio Alves, Dick Farney and a very young Tom Jobim were recording what was then called "samba-jazz".

Check here this 1947 song (10 years before bossa nova officially appeared):


Here another samba-jazz, this time from 1954:


The real and final bossa nova, a kid where samba and jazz were parents only appeared in 1958, with the now famous LP named "Canção do Amor Demais", which contained this landmark by Tom Jobim and Vinicius de Moraes:

BTW, the name bossa nova (new trend) was revived in 1958 since it has been used since the 1930s by Noel Rosa, Carmen Miranda and others and initially it referred to the orchestrated urban samba in opposition to the more raw root samba from the favelas. 

EDIT: although my username here is Atkingani everyone knows me by my nickname Guigo. Wink And welcome Dionisio. Smile


Edited by Atkingani - 16 Aug 2011 at 2:55pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dionisio Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Aug 2011 at 2:54pm
Makes more sense like this then, i didnt knew any of these, in fact, the stupid thing is that we are teached that bossa nova is the biggest jazzy friend, and the only samba i know is the one from the samba schools and carnivals, not as influenced and influencee of jazz. Great great, thank you !

EDIT: Oh ! Agradecido ! Back to english, thank you again !


Edited by dionisio - 16 Aug 2011 at 3:01pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atkingani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Aug 2011 at 2:58pm
Be welcome, Dionisio! Smile Seja bem-vindo!




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atkingani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Aug 2011 at 8:08am
Chorinho is close to samba and close to jazz and a fine soundtrack for a Sunday meal with friends and family.

More:


And a bit more:

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atkingani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Aug 2011 at 8:18am
Even Chet Atkins experienced the chorinho taste:

The original here (the correct name is Waldyr Azevedo):



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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kazuhiro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Aug 2011 at 7:54pm

Thank you for sharing the video,Guigo.
These Chorinho seems to be traditional music for people in Brazil.

It is very interesting. And, I thought about distinguished services of Joao Gilberto that developed those music to bossa nova again at the same time.

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atkingani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Aug 2011 at 6:01pm
Tim Maia, the king of samba-soul.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atkingani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 Aug 2011 at 6:02pm
More Tim Maia (1942-1998).




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atkingani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Sep 2011 at 4:39pm
"The clear tear on the dark skin
The clear rain on the dark night"


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atkingani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Sep 2011 at 4:49pm
Joyce Moreno, probably the best female composer of samba and bossa-nova - a great singer also.




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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Kazuhiro Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 02 Sep 2011 at 11:47pm

Thank you for sharing this. A lot of fans of Joyce exist also in Japan. She is a really good singer.

By the way, there is a singer of famous bossa-nova in Japan. It was said that it was born in Sao Paulo and had touched music though Lisa Ono was Japanese.

What do you think?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atkingani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Sep 2011 at 1:50pm
I know Lisa Ono and I like her, Kazuhiro-san. She actually was born in São Paulo, SP, Brasil. Smile
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atkingani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Sep 2011 at 11:47pm
Maria Bethania is a great Brazilian singer who also recorded a lot of sambas and the likes. Here she sings a Bahia-style samba composed by her brother Caetano Veloso.


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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Atkingani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Sep 2011 at 12:01am
Maria Bethania sings Heitor Villa-Lobos.


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